New England Lab Breeders


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By bwain - 9/12/2012 8:11:57 PM
Hey Everyone,

I'm looking for a breeder in New England - Eastern Massachusetts, Southern Maine or Southern New Hampshire that breeds Labradors for field work. Preferably hunting, but trials would probably be ok as well. I haven't had much luck on my own finding anyone with pups available. If anyone can lend some recommendations I'd be much obliged.

Thanks!

--Brian


...I have proof that when people die
they become birds. And I've lost
my chance to go to sea or become a cowboy.
--- Jim Harrison
By powderski14 - 9/12/2012 8:15:07 PM
Don't know if Jersey is too far but Jane at red lion kennels always has pups.  She has both chessies and English bred labs from strong pedigrees.    Www.redlionkennels.com
By jcropsey - 9/13/2012 11:23:37 AM
Diane Pilbin at Chucklebrook Kennels is in Central NH...New London I think.  Been in the business a long time, has some hunting stock, but mostly show circuit.  However, she will NOT breed a dog that doesn't hunt -or is difficult to train.  Use my name.  She usually breeds a few times a year.

Don & Donna White hrcregion2@msn.com.  Don is the rep for the Hunting Retriever Club.  He has a good dog, RADAR.  Done very well in hunt trials.  Don't know about any pups. Use my name.  He WILL NOT stear you wrong.

If you go to the Hunting Retriever Club website, there's Granite State Hunting Retrievers, http://www.gshrc.net/, Yankee Waterfowlers, http://www.ywhrc.com/, covering CT, RI & MA and Saco River, http://www.srhrc.org/, in southern Maine.  These are not field trial dogs, although some breeders do some trial work.  Club secretaries usually know who has pups on the ground, and how the parents have done in hunt tests.

NAHRA is worth checking out too.  Just not as many events/clubs in NE.  http://www.nahra.org/.  Many of the HRC clubs are also NAHRA clubs.
By Pit Boss - 9/13/2012 5:19:42 PM
My two cents, I would stay as far away from any show dogs as possible, no matter if they are hunted or not. There is a reason they are show dogs. You will end up with a real pig that has no style. If you want to see what a hunting show dog looks like go to your nearest WC/WCX trial event. Do yourself a favor and if you cannot find a good dog within driving distance then have one shipped. Go to the link below and you should be able to find a nice dog.

http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?31-Classifieds-Lab-Puppies



I looked at Red Lion Kennels-  I wouldn't want to spend my hard earned money buying dog food for anything on that web-site! Two of the stud dogs are Junior Hunter titled:laugh:. In case you are not familiar with what it takes to get a pass in a JH stake, all you need is to pick up two land singles and two water singles. These are puppy marks. I ran one of these with my dog at six months and got a pass. By no means am I bragging but rather trying to explain what little value there is in a JH title. I would be more concerned with why they were not able to achieve a higher title. Again this is another breeder to avoid.

Make sure you buy the best you can afford. If you have to wait a year you will be better off. 
MAke sure the parents have all the health clearances. OFA hips and elbows, CERF (eyes), EIC and CNM. If they will not offer a guarantee, run away fast.
By powderski14 - 9/13/2012 6:30:00 PM
Yes some of red lion's litters are only jh but a lot are also senior and master level hunters.  She has litters that are more for show but then she also has litters are are for hunting/trials.  I have no complaints about my chessie from her, and neither do the plenty of guys I know from a club that have dogs from her.  This is just my .02 with what I know about her chessies.
By Pit Boss - 9/13/2012 8:36:53 PM
powderski14 (9/13/2012)
Yes some of red lion's litters are only jh but a lot are also senior and master level hunters.  She has litters that are more for show but then she also has litters are are for hunting/trials.  I have no complaints about my chessie from her, and neither do the plenty of guys I know from a club that have dogs from her.  This is just my .02 with what I know about her chessies.
They bred a JH male to two non-titled females? $1,300 for one litter and $1,100 for the other. Now that is Frickin hilarious!:laugh: Posts like this drive me nuts. I even did a search on EE and could not find the JH dog on there. The sire is eight years old and has a crappy pedigree and is only a JH. Almost worth the $900 stud fee.:D Did I mention this is hilarious.

By Tim Price - 9/13/2012 8:50:22 PM
I agree to stay away from show stock in labs. In 20 years of seeing dogs at HTs, I have only seen 1 show pedigreed lab that I would say was worth feeding. This dog was outstanding, crushed the master I was working at, and its owners actually agreed that she was a freak for her pedigree. On the other hand, I've seen countless others with show pedigrees whose owners were far more interested in being there than the dogs. Painful to watch for the most part because most of the show dogs don't want to be there. Their owners go because they want to say the dog has a field title. That's why many show dogs have a WCX. It's stuff a field bred lab can do at 4-5 months of age BUT the show people say their dog has a field title. The funny thing is if you look at what was in the show ring 30-40 years ago, the top trial/HT labs of today look far more like them then the current show dogs.   

Now there is a difference between the labs and chessie people re show. Many of their working dogs also go to the show ring. That breed hasn't had the defined split as is seen in the labs so your chessie may be a good working dog from show stock with HT background. It the lab world....not so much.

I also agree not to limit yourself to such a small geographic area. Some places don't have good litters nearby. You're hopefully going to have this dog for 10-14 years. If you have to drive 6-10 hours to pick it up, it's part of the deal.   
By Pit Boss - 9/13/2012 9:20:00 PM
I am still peeing my pants on the $1,300 JH litter. The thing that really cracks me up is that they own both the sire and dam and this is most likely a natural breeding so there is no AI expense and there is no progesterone testing. IMO, they are overcharging $1,000 a pup. 
I am trying to buy a pup for a friend and I just got off the phone with a guy that has an FC sire x MH bitch and the cost is almost half what the JH litter is priced at and of course that includes a health guarantee. 
To the people who read this and think I am a dickhead, too bad. I am just trying to post facts so the buyer can make an intelligent decision and not get ripped off.
By Swamper - 9/13/2012 9:51:13 PM
Pit Boss (9/13/2012)
My two cents, I would stay as far away from any show dogs as possible, no matter if they are hunted or not. There is a reason they are show dogs. You will end up with a real pig that has no style. If you want to see what a hunting show dog looks like go to your nearest WC/WCX trial event. Do yourself a favor and if you cannot find a good dog within driving distance then have one shipped. Go to the link below and you should be able to find a nice dog.

http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?31-Classifieds-Lab-Puppies



I looked at Red Lion Kennels-  I wouldn't want to spend my hard earned money buying dog food for anything on that web-site! Two of the stud dogs are Junior Hunter titled:laugh:. In case you are not familiar with what it takes to get a pass in a JH stake, all you need is to pick up two land singles and two water singles. These are puppy marks. I ran one of these with my dog at six months and got a pass. By no means am I bragging but rather trying to explain what little value there is in a JH title. I would be more concerned with why they were not able to achieve a higher title. Again this is another breeder to avoid.

Make sure you buy the best you can afford. If you have to wait a year you will be better off. MAke sure the parents have all the health clearances. OFA hips and elbows, CERF (eyes), EIC and CNM. If they will not offer a guarantee, run away fast.
 which event did you run your 6 month old and is it posted in EE?i think you are underplaying a well run, organized JH event to new members here.  should the dogs start at senior level? or skip right up to Master?JH legs can make a back yard retrieve master look pretty darn pathetic if conditions of the day, number of participants and course layout are at a challenging level.   wouldn't you agree?

i would not agree that you are a d**k h**d, and much of your advise is worthy of considering. but your JH title has no value comment....................has no value.

rewind and try again..
By Tim Price - 9/14/2012 1:00:59 PM
Swamper (9/13/2012)
Pit Boss (9/13/2012)
In case you are not familiar with what it takes to get a pass in a JH stake, all you need is to pick up two land singles and two water singles. These are puppy marks. I ran one of these with my dog at six months and got a pass. By no means am I bragging but rather trying to explain what little value there is in a JH title. I would be more concerned with why they were not able to achieve a higher title. Again this is another breeder to avoid.

Make sure you buy the best you can afford. If you have to wait a year you will be better off. MAke sure the parents have all the health clearances. OFA hips and elbows, CERF (eyes), EIC and CNM. If they will not offer a guarantee, run away fast.


 which event did you run your 6 month old and is it posted in EE?i think you are underplaying a well run, organized JH event to new members here.  should the dogs start at senior level? or skip right up to Master?JH legs can make a back yard retrieve master look pretty darn pathetic if conditions of the day, number of participants and course layout are at a challenging level.   wouldn't you agree?

i would not agree that you are a d**k h**d, and much of your advise is worthy of considering. but your JH title has no value comment....................has no value.

rewind and try again..


Swamper I'll give you my .02 re the JH and where I think Pit was coming from. Many people with inferior dogs who produce litters use the JH as a way to say their dog has a field title. That's crap IMO. The dam of my current dog had her JH within 10 days of turning 6 months. I was working at a HT when my current dog was 4-5 months old and they needed a test dog so I grabbed Lola from the truck. She crushed it. They were all asking about her blah blah blah and I didn't have the heart to tell them she was just over 4 months old. The point being (which is where I think Pit was going) is a well bred well trained lab using the right training program, has been thru Basics and maybe even FF can hammer a Junior setup at 6 months. Period.

Now I understand the need for that level of test as a retriever club member, former club treasurer, and former HT chairman.... The Junior can make your club money. I personally have never entered a Junior and never will. I start with Senior and don't start there until I'm running master stuff in training so the Senior tests are easy. That's just me. I also advise people who ask me when to start running for ribbons to skip Junior. I hope you don't think I'm a di**he*d eiither. LOL I advise them of this because dogs learn bad habits when running Juniors because the people often don't have their dogs thru specific steps in training.

Examples....you see dogs not pick up a duck because it's never seen one, you see dogs switch, cheat, break, mouth birds, etc because of inexperience and again lack of training. My advise, of course, is directed at people who are goal oriented and have a dog that they want to put an MH on. For those who have a dog that doesn't have "it" and will never make it to that level and SH may be their goal, I can see why they would want to run in Junior. I always tell them they should be training at the level above where they are entering at HTs so they are much more likely to succeed.

Please don't get me wrong here. I completely understand the enjoyment of receiving a ribbon and the feeling of accomplishment. For some that JH ribbon may be the coolest thing and I get that. I think Pit's trying to say don't use a JH to sell pups because when you step back and look at the big picture, JH marks are puppy marks. Why pay more for a JH sire or dam when you can get way more pedigree for less money?  
By Pit Boss - 9/14/2012 4:44:59 PM
Tim Price (9/14/2012)
[quote][b]
Please don't get me wrong here. I completely understand the enjoyment of receiving a ribbon and the feeling of accomplishment. For some that JH ribbon may be the coolest thing and I get that. I think Pit's trying to say don't use a JH to sell pups because when you step back and look at the big picture, JH marks are puppy marks. Why pay more for a JH sire or dam when you can get way more pedigree for less money?  


That is exactly what I am saying. That doesn't mean I do not think that JH stakes are of no value. I hope if a person attains his/her JH title the success will push them to continue towards training a higher level dog. I will also say that because a dog has a JH title, that does not mean that the dog cannot produce quality pups. In fact, I have a couple of untitled dogs in one of my dogs pedigrees. They both produced quality pups with at least a dozen becoming FCs, including Nick of Time Lone Ranger. This is where the buyer better understand pedigrees really well or otherwise IMO it is a huge risk. Like I said, if someone is breeding a JH dog, the first question a person should ask is why couldn't they get a higher title? It leaves me asking too many questions and too many risks if the dog cannot even attain a SH title. 
Number of dogs entered in a JH event should have no bearing on whether the tests are made more difficult. You are not competing against other dogs, instead you are being held to a standard. The standard, IMO, is really low. These are short non-cheating singles with no factors and you can restrain the dog by holding his/her collar? Are you really going to tell me you think a dog that is not even required to be steady, cannot handle and cannot do multiple marks that these dogs should be bred? How are you improving the breed?
By powderski14 - 9/14/2012 5:58:45 PM
Pit.....not saying you're a d-head, I was just saying my experience.  My chessie from her was from master and senior level parents.  I don't know much about her labs, but My chessie is doing great and got his first goose last week.  I would definitely get another chessie from her. 
By Pit Boss - 9/14/2012 8:05:11 PM
They can have the best Chessies in the world and I wouldn't know. The only thing I know about Chessies is that they are the best retrievers. Oops, I guess I don't know anything about Chessies. JK
By Swamper - 9/14/2012 9:18:33 PM
Tim Price (9/14/2012)
Swamper (9/13/2012)
Pit Boss (9/13/2012)
In case you are not familiar with what it takes to get a pass in a JH stake, all you need is to pick up two land singles and two water singles. These are puppy marks. I ran one of these with my dog at six months and got a pass. By no means am I bragging but rather trying to explain what little value there is in a JH title. I would be more concerned with why they were not able to achieve a higher title. Again this is another breeder to avoid.

Make sure you buy the best you can afford. If you have to wait a year you will be better off. MAke sure the parents have all the health clearances. OFA hips and elbows, CERF (eyes), EIC and CNM. If they will not offer a guarantee, run away fast.


 which event did you run your 6 month old and is it posted in EE?i think you are underplaying a well run, organized JH event to new members here.  should the dogs start at senior level? or skip right up to Master?JH legs can make a back yard retrieve master look pretty darn pathetic if conditions of the day, number of participants and course layout are at a challenging level.   wouldn't you agree?

i would not agree that you are a d**k h**d, and much of your advise is worthy of considering. but your JH title has no value comment....................has no value.

rewind and try again..


Swamper I'll give you my .02 re the JH and where I think Pit was coming from. Many people with inferior dogs who produce litters use the JH as a way to say their dog has a field title. That's crap IMO. The dam of my current dog had her JH within 10 days of turning 6 months. I was working at a HT when my current dog was 4-5 months old and they needed a test dog so I grabbed Lola from the truck. She crushed it. They were all asking about her blah blah blah and I didn't have the heart to tell them she was just over 4 months old. The point being (which is where I think Pit was going) is a well bred well trained lab using the right training program, has been thru Basics and maybe even FF can hammer a Junior setup at 6 months. Period.

Now I understand the need for that level of test as a retriever club member, former club treasurer, and former HT chairman.... The Junior can make your club money. I personally have never entered a Junior and never will. I start with Senior and don't start there until I'm running master stuff in training so the Senior tests are easy. That's just me. I also advise people who ask me when to start running for ribbons to skip Junior. I hope you don't think I'm a di**he*d eiither. LOL I advise them of this because dogs learn bad habits when running Juniors because the people often don't have their dogs thru specific steps in training.

Examples....you see dogs not pick up a duck because it's never seen one, you see dogs switch, cheat, break, mouth birds, etc because of inexperience and again lack of training. My advise, of course, is directed at people who are goal oriented and have a dog that they want to put an MH on. For those who have a dog that doesn't have "it" and will never make it to that level and SH may be their goal, I can see why they would want to run in Junior. I always tell them they should be training at the level above where they are entering at HTs so they are much more likely to succeed.

Please don't get me wrong here. I completely understand the enjoyment of receiving a ribbon and the feeling of accomplishment. For some that JH ribbon may be the coolest thing and I get that. I think Pit's trying to say don't use a JH to sell pups because when you step back and look at the big picture, JH marks are puppy marks. Why pay more for a JH sire or dam when you can get way more pedigree for less money?  


that's a clear explanation.  i wouldn't argue that.

clearly a JH title dog is not a level to be searching for to buy a "quality pup".  I get that also.

I have entered into the "test" environment as a way to keep me and the dog focused on "training".  the ribbon is not my goal.  i equate the JH with being a First Class Boy Scout.  A pup that can run through 4 JH stakes "should be" capable of sitting next to you in a blind and be a contributing partner.  Same as a First Class Scout.  Surely doesn't know everything, but has the basic skills to build on.  that's how "i" see the value of Junior hunt tests. 

i did, as you mentioned, see some dogs that were not even "bird dogs".  they either wouldn't pick up the duck or bring it back if they did.  however, i felt each one of those owner/handlers were there for their own personal reasons, such as myself.  i would hope it wasn't to get a JH so they can start marketing pups.   but..........it happens.  we can't fix that.
By Swamper - 9/14/2012 9:39:22 PM
Pit Boss (9/14/2012)
[quote]Tim Price (9/14/2012)
[quote][b]
Number of dogs entered in a JH event should have no bearing on whether the tests are made more difficult.
 my point regarding the number of participants didn't relate to the test itself.  it is true that hunt tests don't pit dog against dog.  by number of participants i was referring the the highly charged environment of a hunt test grounds that a well attended test can produce....the more participants the more barking dogs in kennel,  guns going off, people and dogs moving all around.  it is an environment most young dogs are not used to.  the event environment in itself is a good training device for the inevitable first day in the blind.  :)